PCOS, also known as Polycystic Ovarian Syndrome is a complex condition that can significantly affect a woman’s quality of life. One of the biggest ways it does this is by impacting on a women’s ability to conceive and maintain a pregnancy, but it can also impact a woman’s self-esteem by making it difficult to lose weight, it causes acne and hair issues, such as too much hair where a woman doesn’t want it to be, and potentially thinning of scalp hair.

Of course, there is more to it than that, but those are the major things that women report as the issues they’re most upset by.

In this article and podcast I will discuss the lack of awareness and poor understanding surrounding PCOS, how it is often misunderstood and why its name has a role in this. I discuss the common, and not so common signs and symptoms of PCOS and talk about the driving factors that can cause PCOS to develop. I talk about how PCOS is often diagnosed and discuss some of the key ways PCOS can be addressed naturally.

You can listen to this article on the podcast links below, or in the embedded player.

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Understanding PCOS

Lack of awareness

Sadly, but not unexpectedly there is a lack of awareness and understanding of PCOS, with many people who have not been diagnosed not aware of the condition at all, but also women who have been diagnosed, and some health practitioners as well, not properly understanding the condition. A big part of this lack of awareness is the lack of research into the condition, but also I believe it is part of the bigger picture of gender bias in medicine, and many conditions that are specific to women do not have the attention they deserve, perhaps the exception being breast cancer. One of the other things that doesn’t help this lack of awareness and understanding is the name of the condition itself – polycystic ovarian syndrome.

The name makes a few false implications which cause overall confusion – so here are a few points I want you to know:

1. The condition doesn’t originate in ovaries and the condition is not all about ovaries either, after menopause, the condition can persist. It is more of a metabolic condition, with systemic high androgens and insulin resistance being the core drivers.
2. A PCOS ovary doesn’t actually have ‘cysts’, rather what you can see on ultrasound is immature follicles. Follicles are the little sacks that your oocyte, or eggs sit in waiting for the hormones from the brain to tell it to mature and then ovulate. The issue is these follicles in PCOS is they aren’t developing properly, so if we got them to develop fully these so-called cysts would be a baby (if met with a sperm).

A new name?

Many physicians and researchers have proposed a name change for PCOS, however, that was being proposed in 2013 and it’s 2020, so who knows when that will happen. I agree the condition does need a name change, as I feel PCOS is not a good representation. One of the names suggested which I like is ‘metabolic reproductive syndrome’, however other names suggested were Poly-follicular ovarian syndrome with metabolic dysfunction and/or hyperandrogenic manifestations (PFOS-MD and/or -HM).

The list of potential signs and symptoms is long for PCOS, which explains why there are so many women out there that don’t know why they have the symptoms they do.

PCOS Symptoms

Most common symptoms of PCOS include:

• Irregular periods or absent periods
• Acne
• Weight gain
• Excessive hair growth, also known as hirsutism. This can vary in locations and intensity and it will also be different dependant on your nationality.

Less well known, but still common symptoms:

• Anxiety and/or depression
• Fatigue
• Brain fog
• Skin tags
• dark patches on the skin
• low libido
• Sleep disturbances and snoring (Sleep apnoea can also be more common due to the higher level of androgens. Poor sleep can worsen PCOS by worsening insulin resistance.)

And more than that, there are other complications, especially regarding fertility and baby’s health. The higher levels of androgens can increase the risk of miscarriage and are also linked with some increased risk for baby such as higher birth weight. Women with PCOS also tend to have difficulty with breastfeeding and a higher risk of diabetes after birth.

Thankfully, many of these risks are modifiable by correcting the underlying causes of PCOS, which I will discuss later.

Causes of PCOS – How does the switch get turned on

There are different ways PCOS can express, and for these different subtypes, there are different causes.

The main cause is insulin resistance, which causes the male hormones androgens to become high. Insulin, when it is too high, can trigger more production of testosterone, but it can also lower the amount of SHBG (sex hormone-binding globulin) which means our bodies can’t bind up the excessive testosterone as well, and so more is circulating our body, causing the symptoms of PCOS such as acne and hair issues. Insulin excess also affects our FSH : LH ratio which is important for ovulation, and high testosterone stops our follicles from maturing completely, so this means woman’s ability to ovulate is affected, and if that is affected their chances of conceiving is reduced, and oestrogen and progesterone balance is also affected.

There are different types of androgens, such as testosterone, DHEA and androstenedione, and depending on which one is elevated we can get an idea of what is driving your PCOS. For instance, if DHEA is high, we know that stress is a big driver.

It is also possible to have PCOS without insulin resistance and this is typically due to inflammation. this is a much rarer subtype, but certainly something to consider.

Something else to consider is your gut health can play a role in both hormone balance and metabolism. Your gut bacteria are responsible for so many things in the body, and if you’ve listened to my previous podcasts or read some of my other blog posts you’ll know that your microbiome is of vital importance in improving health. How does it affect PCOS? Well, if your microbiome is out of balance it can affect your metabolism, which can worsen insulin resistance. And an out of balance microbiome can also cause hormone problems, by allowing more of your ‘bad’ hormone metabolites to cycle back through the body.

Why do you have a PCOS ‘switch’ in the first place?

We know there is a genetic component to it, and there is some possibility that your genetic likelihood can be influenced by exposure to endocrine-disrupting chemicals in past generations, substances that are passed through generations. So effectively, what chemicals and diet your Grandmother was exposed to will impact your risk for PCOS.

This transgenerational effect has been demonstrated in animal studies when mice were fed an obesogenic diet and were given substances that mimic a high androgen state to bring about a metabolic state of PCOS, and it was found that their subsequent generations also expressed this condition.

It was also found that women with PCOS had levels of chemicals in their system that were not in use anymore and was found to have been passed through in utero from their mothers and grandmothers.

These chemicals are increasing the activity of the androgens and also acting as obesogens, contributing to the weight gain and insulin resistance.

Diagnosis issues

So how common is PCOS? The prevalence is about 8-13%, effectively 1 in 10 women. But it is a condition that is it is both over-diagnosed in young girls, and under-diagnosed in older women.

One of the issues in getting diagnosed is that there isn’t one specific diagnostic criteria, so you can get mixed messages.

Three main diagnostic criteria exist- the National Institutes of Health, the Rotterdam criteria and the Androgen Excess Society criteria.

All of the criteria require all other possible endocrine disorders to be excluded.

My criteria of choice is the Rotterdam diagnostic criteria. It requires a female to have two of these three criteria:

1. Irregular periods
2. Clinical and/or biochemical hyperandrogenism
3. “Polycystic ovaries”

Many young girls are being prematurely diagnosed with PCOS. But it is normal for young girls to present with some symptoms of PCOS and this often resolves in a few years without intervention. It can take 3-6 years for a menstrual cycle to regulate itself, however if there is early intervention this can prolong this process, and it is thought that the most common recommendation given at this time – the oral contraceptive pill (OCP) can worsen insulin resistance, which perpetuates the condition.

What are the other causes that need to be excluded?

This could be conditions such as Cushing’s, Adrenal tumours or congenital adrenal hyperplasia. Screening would include blood tests for TSH, prolactin, FSH and anything else your practitioner feels warranted based on your signs and symptoms.

PCOS and Teens

Getting back to teenage girls and their periods, it’s not uncommon for girls to have irregular periods when they’re young, and this will usually regulate itself within 6 years. My personal preference in clinic is to not interfere with hormones in young girls but to allow their bodies to regulate themselves. If hormones are interfered with too early, then it will typically delay the regulation until later. This is relevant to not just herbs, but especially to things such as hormonal contraceptives.

A common understanding is that women with PCOS literally have cysts on their ovaries. But this isn’t the case, as the name implies. the polycystic ovarian appearance that some (but important to note, not all) women have on ultrasound is actually a higher count of immature eggs within their follicles. These eggs aren’t getting the signal from the brain to mature further, triggering ovulation and release.

If you can remember the diagnostic criteria, the presence of 2 of the 3 criteria is what it takes to get diagnosed, so if a woman has irregular periods and signs of high androgens, she can have PCOS without the presences of any ‘cysts’ on her ovaries at all.

A more positive perspective.

One of the perspectives I have heard before about PCOS which I love is that this is an evolutionary trait which in years gone by was protective. if you consider that being pregnant and giving birth was a life-threatening thing at worst, and a depleting event at best, it can make sense why a condition like PCOS which can reduce one’s fertility may be protective in tough times. Insulin resistance is beneficial in times of scarcity as it allows you to store more of the energy from foods, which in famine times if beneficial. In times of plenty such as now, this, unfortunately, works against us. In a time without contraception, women may have gone from one baby to the next without a break, which can be quite a high level of stress and depletion. So, for women with PCOS who have longer times between ovulation, and so fewer opportunities to conceive, this could be considered a positive thing. Nowadays this might not be much comfort especially if you’re wanting to conceive, but I believe anytime you can view your health from more a positive light it is beneficial, so ladies with PCOS you might like to shift your frame of thinking to more of an ‘I’m a survivor’ mindset.  

Other considerations for PCOS

Sleep

Sleep disturbances are reported to be twice as likely for women with PCOS. Studies show found that women with PCOS are more likely to report difficulty falling asleep, to have restless sleep occasionally and often feel severely tired. Sleep problems also occurred in women with PCOS who were in the normal weight range.

It’s still unclear how PCOS affects sleep but we know that the metabolic impacts of the condition play a big role. The hormones melatonin and cortisol are responsible for our sleep cycles to a large degree and these are strongly influenced by insulin resistance and elevated testosterone, as well as the stress placed on the body if obese.

Sleep apnoea is also often reported in women with PCOS, more often in those who are overweight. In those people who are considered to be ‘severely obese’, (BMI >40kg/m2) the prevalence of sleep apnoea in both men and women can be as high as 92%.

The mental health impacts of PCOS which is an increase of anxiety and depression have a bidirectional association with poor sleep quality and insomnia.

Weight loss and exercise is one of the best ways to improve sleep quality in women with PCOS, and if needed there are herbal medicines which can be of support.

Nutrients such as magnesium and calcium and the amino acid l-theanine can also be supportive to calm the nervous system and promote relaxation and sleep.

PCOS and Mental Health

Women with PCOS have higher rates of anxiety and depression. PCOS can be a very distressing condition for many women and this varies from person to person, with some of the highest reported contributors to the anxiety and depression is the impact to fertility, the impact on physical appearance and self-esteem such as weight issues, hirsutism and acne, and also the frustration about the lack of a clear cut solution, and a lack of awareness and understanding of the condition. There was a study that found that women with PCOS were physically active reported less depression and anxiety than those who were inactive. So, while I love to use herbal medicines to support mood and the nervous system, I do frequently recommend exercise to support mood in women with PCOS.

Potential pregnancy risks

There are a few things to consider when trying to conceive, as women with PCOS have an increased risk of some complications during pregnancy. The good news is that if PCOS has been treated, these risks return to almost the same levels as women who do not have PCOS. The risks include an increased likelihood of developing gestational diabetes, pregnancy-induced hypertension and preterm birth, and an increased risk of neonatal complications.

The increase in birth weight of babies born to women with PCOS also suggests an increased likelihood of c-section deliveries.

The treatment used in the study I mentioned before was anti-androgenic therapy, which means correcting hormonal balance before conceiving will improve pregnancy outcomes.

one small study looked at the incidence of gestational diabetes in women with PCOS and found the prevalence was 30.2%, and that these women had impaired blood sugar levels after having their babies. What we can take from this is that PCOS can have a long term impact on glucose metabolism, and again it highlights how important it is to try and take steps to improve your hormones and blood sugar level balance before conceiving.

I recommend that all couples do a preconception care program before conceiving, which at a minimum entails taking a high quality preconception care nutrient complex for 3-4 months before conceiving but if there are hormonal imbalances its important to work on this with a practitioner before trying to conceive.

Complications with breastfeeding

A lesser-known complication with PCOS is that it can cause some difficulties with breastfeeding and milk supply – however, this can also be supported by working on hormones before pregnancy, and with the support of a lactation consultant after birth. Thankfully not all women with PCOS experience difficulties breastfeeding and the information that says it is potentially problematic is only based on small studies. In the research that we do have available, the breastfeeding difficulties were only experienced in the first 3 months and seemed to regulate after that time.

Breastfeeding requires the hormones prolactin and oxytocin to work properly, but we also need adequate progesterone during pregnancy for the breast tissue to develop properly. Insulin resistance and high androgens can affect hormones in all these aspects.

How to manage PCOS

There are so many options for treating PCOS, and as it usually the case with naturopathic remedies, you get the best results when you are treated holistically. This means considering various things like what exactly is happening with your PCOS subtype.

The information I am giving you is a starting point to take to your practitioner to discuss whether it is right for you and to give you hope that there are so many possibilities to help.

while there have not been studies finding some remedies that tend to be universally helpful for most PCOS sub-types, and one of that does seem to be of great benefit is the amino acid Inositol. Taking 2g twice a day is my recommended dose for this.

Diet and lifestyle changes are great for treating insulin resistance, and while it’s tricky to find research specifically for this in PCOS we know it helps address the cause.

I recommend 150 minutes of exercise a week, which can be split into small blocks of exercise such as 30 minutes 5 times a week, or larger chunks such as 50 minutes three times a week. Eating a low GI/GL diet is also very important to address insulin resistance, and having a diet rich in antioxidants and low in inflammatory foods is also very helpful.

If you are overweight and have PCOS, then aiming to lose 5-10% of your body weight is a fantastic goal, and this amount seems to be the magic number that improves fertility rates and reduces risks for diabetes. Losing weight ideally would be done through a combination of diet and exercise.

Nutrients such as magnesium, b vitamins, particularly activated B vitamins, vitamin D and chromium can also be helpful.

Omega-3 fatty acids such as fish oil or algae oil can also help with some of the components of PCOS such as high cholesterol and inflammation.

Other herbs that I would consider is Berberine containing herbs such as Phelledendron which helps with improving insulin resistance and regulates blood lipid levels. There is also evidence showing that Black Cohosh can be helpful alongside other PCOS treatment.

The combination of Peony and Licorice has been looked at in Chinese medicine studies, and this is still a good inclusion in treatment, depending on the individual. Bulgarian Tribulus can also be helpful to regulate ovulation.

Spearmint can be helpful to reduce excessive androgens. I like this when used in a tea and is why I included it in one of my tea blends that supports skin health, to address this aspect.

Supporting gut health is also very important, as a poor microbiome can impair metabolism and worsen inflammation. So eating a diet rich in vegetables with lots of diversity is fantastic for improving the flora diversity in the gut, but it can also be helpful to take probiotics or prebiotics, so discuss this with your practitioner to make sure you’ve got the right type for you.

References

Bahri Khomami, M., Boyle, J. A., Tay, C. T., Vanky, E., Teede, H. J., Joham, A. E., & Moran, L. J. (2018). Polycystic ovary syndrome and adverse pregnancy outcomes: Current state of knowledge, challenges and potential implications for practice. Clinical Endocrinology, 88(6), 761-769. https://doi.org/10.1111/cen.13579

Bahri Khomami, M, Joham, AE, Boyle, JA, et al. Increased maternal pregnancy complications in polycystic ovary syndrome appear to be independent of obesity—A systematic review, meta‐analysis, and meta‐regression. Obesity Reviews. 2019; 20: 659– 674. https://doi.org/10.1111/obr.12829

Fernandez, R. C., Moore, V. M., Van Ryswyk, E. M., Varcoe, T. J., Rodgers, R. J., March, W. A., Moran, L. J., Avery, J. C., McEvoy, R. D., & Davies, M. J. (2018). Sleep disturbances in women with polycystic ovary syndrome: prevalence, pathophysiology, impact and management strategies. Nature and science of sleep, 10, 45–64. https://doi.org/10.2147/NSS.S127475

Guerrero-Bosagna C, Weeks S, Skinner MK (2014) Identification of Genomic Features in Environmentally Induced Epigenetic Transgenerational Inherited Sperm Epimutations. PLOS ONE 9(6): e100194. https://doi.org/10.1371/journal.pone.0100194

Guo Z, Qiu H, Wang L, et al. Association of serum organochlorine pesticides concentrations with reproductive hormone levels and polycystic ovary syndrome in a Chinese population. Chemosphere. 2017 Mar;171:595-600. DOI: 10.1016/j.chemosphere.2016.12.127.

Holton, S., Papanikolaou, V., Hammarberg, K., Rowe, H., Kirkman, M., Jordan, L., McNamee, K., Bayly, C., McBain, J., Sinnott, V., & Fisher, J. (2018). Fertility management experiences of women with polycystic ovary syndrome in Australia. European Journal of Contraception and Reproductive Health Care, 23(4), 282-287. https://doi.org/10.1080/13625187.2018.1483020

Mo L, Mansfield DR, Joham A, et al. Sleep disturbances in women with and without polycystic ovary syndrome in an Australian national cohort [published online December 26, 2018]. Clin Endocrinol (Oxf). doi:10.1111/cen.13922

Rosenwaks, Z. (2017). Polycystic ovary syndrome, an enigmatic syndrome begging for a name change. Fertility and Sterility, 108(5), 748–749. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.fertnstert.2017.09.030

The post A Holistic Guide to PCOS appeared first on Alison Mitchell Naturopath.

With Clara Bailey

Guts and Girl Bits Podcast Episode #43

I am joined with the ever graceful and wise Clara Bailey from Mediatrix Wellness. In this episode Clara shares her wisdom about elemental eating – how you can gain health and peace with your diet by eating in alignment with the elements.

You will learn what the elements represent and support in your body, what foods and eating practices can increased or reduce certain elements.

We also chat about intuitive eating, and how this practice can help to reduce binge eating, emotional eating and can help you to build a beautiful relationship with food.

When you combine elemental eating with intuitive eating, it is a recipe for long lasting health.

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The Podcast

Have a listen here on on the embedded player below.

Links we mentioned:

Intuitive Eating – by Evelyn Tribole and Elyse Resch
Book
Intuitive Eating Workbook
Elemental Eating:
A Life of Balance

Get in touch with Clara:

You can find her on Instagram @clarabailey__ and her website is mediatrixwellness.com.au .

Clara creates cycle awareness resources for her newsletter community, called the Moon Times which you subscribe to over at the website.

Podcast Transcript

Alison Mitchell 0:08
Hi, everyone, you’re listening to Guts and Girl Bits. I’m Alison Mitchell, a practicing naturopath. I hope to share with you all sorts of information about women’s health and digestive health, to educate and empower you to make informed choices about your own. Please remember that all information is general and does not replace consulting with your practitioner.

Hey, everyone, I’m joined today with Clara Bailey, and we’re going to be talking about elemental eating, which is a really interesting topic. Most people would have probably seen lots of different recommendations for diet out there in the interwebs. But how do you know what’s right for you? Well today that’s what we’re going to find out and actually understanding the different characteristics that you have and then the different characteristics that different types of foods and herbs can have can mean that you can actually really individualize and personalize your, your eating to get the best health. Thanks so much Clara. I’m so excited to have you here.

Clara Bailey 1:10
Thank you for such a succinct summary of what is a big topic.

Alison Mitchell 1:15
I mentioned it is going to be a bit of a big topic, but we’ll do our best. Can you give us a little bit of a bio about yourself and a bit of a background for those who haven’t heard of you before?

Clara Bailey 1:27
Yes, so I am like you, a naturopath and herbalist. I’m also a fertility awareness educator. And I’ve been in practice six years now and I am clinically focused on women’s health, people with uteruses health and have a big love for really bringing or the keeping the traditional side of our craft alive and balancing it with all I mean, I feel like there’s a lot of great voices advocating for the science side but these more traditional things not so much. So that’s okay. Yeah, strong part of what I do and who I am.

Alison Mitchell 2:08
I love that. And I definitely think that such a important area to bring back into the world of naturopathy. Because we are, we’re our own profession and having that connection to our traditional knowledge and wisdom is really important. And that’s how we’ve had such success for so many years. So if we’re merging into a new paradigm, then it’s not going to do anyone any favors in the long run. And I know that I was trained when I was trying to UWS it had a big, big science background and elements. So when I was a new graduate, that was, you know, where my head was at, whereas the more that I’ve been practicing them, the more I want to really get back into those grassroots concepts.

Clara Bailey 2:55
Yeah, and it’s just so relevant, it’s Yeah, it’s like come through the canon of thousands of years and it’s, you know, so much richness there to reapply to a modern concept, modern context.

Alison Mitchell 3:09
For sure. And so this topic that we’ll be covering today, elemental eating, does touch on a lot of those things as well. It goes back to some of the things that, you know, it’s really hard to actually identify in scientific literature and that is a bit like a constitution or a personality type. Is it possible for you to just give us a brief overview of what is elemental eating before we start getting into the nitty gritty?

Clara Bailey 3:35
Yeah, for sure. I mean, I mean, my first exposure to this even concept of elemental eating was actually as a teenager, I was really into Latino like magical realism books, like the Gael Garcia Marquez and Laura Esquivel and Isabella Lunday, like it’s this whole beautiful body of literature where they just described things with such richness and it was a book code ‘Pomegranate Soup’. And it was going into Zoroastrianism like one of the, like, one of these family members knew these like Secrets of the kitchen, to like, keep the family together and so that big fights wouldn’t roll out. So one of the sisters was very hot headed. And when she was, you know, in one of the moods she would know, to make cucumber yogurt and soup for dinner that night, and it would mean that, you know, that would keep the peace in the family and then, you know, another family member who was very quiet and introverted, you know, when she was getting too much like to that way she would, you know, want to make like fiery, passionate dishes. And so, then when I was doing my naturopathic training and it was, you know, like Indian medicine, Ayurveda and Arabic medicine and Persian medicine had this, you know, there was no, there was a lot of fluidity between food and the home and then medicines. I just loved that concept so much. And this idea of your kitchen becoming your apothecary. So I just always had that lens and that antenna up with anything that referenced that through my training. And then it just put a lot of that to practice and find it to be this really beautiful, intuitive language to talk to people because we all know what you know, something that cold or hot or dry, or moist is so instead of talking about in these overly clinical terms, so the overture to it.

Alison Mitchell 5:36
For sure, and that’s really interesting as well, because, as you mentioned, there’s principles in things like Ayurvedic medicine, and even in Chinese medicine as well, because there’s a lot of talk about the different sorts of constitutions and health patterns that you can have there were like in a beta, there’s the Vata and the Pitta and the Kapha. And then the blends of those and in Chinese medicine in TCM, there’s different elements including things like, like metal, but I haven’t really looked into much of Persian medicine before. What are some of the differences with that?

Clara Bailey 6:12
Well, it’s more actually attuned to the Western, like our Western traditional medicine, I guess, having that similar. They stem from like the Greek, the Greek humoral idea. So humoral meaning that they used to organize their understanding of medicine, and health, according to hot, cold, dry and damp or wet. And so then scholars stayed in Greece and developed those ideas and that sort of brought us to the age of, you know, like Galen, which then really is what we have inherited in our lineage, and then parts of that went off, and it really got, you know, through the Arabic system so their spices and then mixes and all of that, and their cuisine is just often really grounded in those concepts.

Alison Mitchell 7:07
Okay, so that then again, translates into what you were saying as well with the kitchen pharmacy where you can actually heal yourself a lot with the food that you’re eating and, you know, blend up your little potions in the kitchen to do that.

Clara Bailey 7:22
Yeah, exactly. And, yeah, and that, that the kitchen was this like invisible force of wellness. And yes, that and that cookbooks were just as much like, you know, almost spell books, but also medical handbooks back at that time. And it was really Herbs and spices that were forming the baseline of all of that.

Alison Mitchell 7:47
You know, I see a lot of these recipes come through and these pictures of inspiration for clean eating and low carb eating and all of these other forms of eating that’s meant to be health protomoting. But the things that get me excited the most is when you see these herbs and spices actually putting the flavor into it. And that’s what really just drives that healing component. And I think that you can get carried away with counting calories, but it’s not going to bring you health. It’s the nutrients those phytonutrients and there’s different aspects in there. But also the energy of it, isn’t it? It’s which is where it comes down into elemental eating. And we’ve forgotten all about that. It’s something that we probably have done intuitively and you said it before, just just remembering, isn’t it because it’s ingrained in us. So we have to do more intuitive eating in that regard.

So let’s just talk a little bit about the constitutions and the different sorts of categories that people could fall into, to understand then what they need to eat.

Clara Bailey 9:00
Yeah, for sure. So I work off…. So this is very much my remix of taking in lots of different traditional systems of medicine. I’ve just tried to get rid of all the, you know, terms that don’t necessarily mean like a lot of Ayurvedic terms, when you’ve been studying it, they become second nature. But for most people, it ends up sounding like you are speaking another language. So I just go off fire, water, air, fire, earth and ether, ether being the element of space. It’s sort of that expansive… the thing that everything is within. So that’s often like a trickier concept to get your head around the others easy.

First element – water. So wetness, it is associated with winter, and it is when it’s out of balance, like as it would show up in the body. It can present in two ways, one is when there’s an excess loss of fluids. So excess sweating. You know, cases where like for people who just can’t like they just need to go to the bathroom all the time, they like bladders just don’t seem to hold on to anything. Or it’s the opposite where your body is not getting rid of water. So you become it’s like quite a stagnant state. It’s feeling like it’s like water retention and also the body not being able to release its metabolic byproducts. So that can end up manifesting in quite like a stagnant state.

So people who have got like water, you know, a lot of water in their constitution would know that when they’re out of sorts or out of balance, they might tend to one of those sort of patterns of imbalance. And with you know, a line tool that it can also be people who are prone to like a lot of mucus, so sort of like sinus, the issues, if they get sick, the phlegm just seems to stick around for a long time.

And they can also it can also feel like it’s difficult to shift weight for these people. It’s like that more like, clinically, clinically we talk about people who have like lower metabolic rate, whether that’s naturally or it’s actually been caused by a deeper imbalance. But this is all sort of associated with the water element. It’s also the most if we’re talking about yin yang it’s also the most Yin element of them all so it’s very, it’s very introverted and it’s a it also I mean, water is a real seat of emotions as well. So I mean, if people there’s a lot of astrological associations with all these elements as well it’s like the really like the Pisces, and difficulty moving fluid out of the body can be these people’s sort of Achilles heels.

So foods that are really good when you’re in this sort of sense of, when this is out of balance is you want foods that are going to give you structure. So we talked about this more like a mouthfeel, rather than a flavor like astringent foods. And also foods that can help like alter the metabolism help the body to eliminate waste and herb term used for that is alternatives. So spices that are really wonderful for this is as we’re talking about before and Iranian spice called sumac, which is used a lot with lamb and in rice dishes and it’s when you have too much of it, it will make your mouth pucker, that’s the astringent taste or when you leave a cup of tea for too long and a lot of the tannins get extracted.

Alison Mitchell 13:01
Is it like pungent?

Clara Bailey 13:03
Pungent is slightly different, pungent like is what like diffuses across the tongue like mustard or black pepper. This is what we can imagine eating a really green banana. And it’s sort of like, ‘TSK. or an unripe apple.

Alison Mitchell 13:15
Ah, okay. Yeah. So real puckery, dry.

Clara Bailey 13:21
Almost sour, yeah. But it sort of pools tissues together. And all your alteratives which sort of, these herbs that can help give the body a hand at eliminating waste. And so things that are really simple that a lot of people would know about in that category of things like nettles, and dandelion, and violets and chickweed and your red clovers. So yeah, both of those. Those elements are really helpful when that’s about and also seaweed, seaweeds are fabulous. Especially if you’re losing a lot of fluids and salts. electrolytes are really important for these people, or if you’re in this kind of imbalance.

And then next element is the element of air. And when that is out of balance, we get a state of dryness. And so that’s dryness of skin, of the membrane. So feeling like constantly thirsty feeling like you’ve got to really know like dry nose. It can also manifest in like, dry, like poppy, creaky joints, and also tending towards more constipation or difficulty passing stools.

With these, when you’re in this state, it’s all about nourishment, getting water and oils into the, into the cells. So, I mean, you can get into a state of dryness through like after a period of a lot of like pushing yourself too hard. Or just you know, possibly not nourishing yourself. Liking Would you just feeling like a bit with it and like we just want to get beautiful nutrients into all those cells. So fluid of course is really important here, but also tonic oils, so lots of lovely healthy things like all your Omegas, your hemps, your hemp oil, fish oils, evening primrose oils, and with your Herbs you want, we’ve got this beautiful class of Herbs called the emollients and the mucilage containing herb. This is really beautiful, particularly if you are tending towards constipation. So these are Herbs are plants that when they’re exposed to water, they become beautiful and slippery. So these are things like marshmallow root and you slippery elm and flax seeds. And so bringing those into the diet can remarkably help with all those symptoms and bring that back into balance. And often I’ll say Here you often get these elements and combinations so you know you can get that real like dryness from heat in the summer just you know if you’ve you know been exposed to too much sun and your skin’s feeling like dried out but also equally if you’re in a, you know, a deep winter and in the mountains that can be incredibly drying as well.

So, yeah, nutrients, nutrients, nutrients and sweet tonics as well. So a lot of our herbs that we love are adaptogens so, you know, your liquid dishes and your American ginseng and Siberian Ginseng, like when you taste these, these are all really sweet. And the sweet flavor connotes that it’s building and nourishing. It’s why kids love the sweet flavor so much, because they’re just doing so much building.

So yeah, that’s often a nice thing to talk to people about like sweet foods, but naturally sweet foods like your sweet potatoes and putting lots of olive oil on there.

Alison Mitchell 16:59
Yeah, and in constitution’s the hot and dry constitutions in Ayurveda they often recommend putting oil on topically as well as part of their daily practice. Do you think that to ya know for especially for these kind of people.

Clara Bailey 17:16
Yeah doing an even this is so lovely to do is like herbal infused oils. So if you’ve got like that real dry heat like you just said like doing a rose sesame oil is like cooling but nourishing.

Alison Mitchell 17:31
If you’re tending to that like cold dry, you might want to put more like, more like your mugwort so your gingers are sort of as more warming notes to oil. And that would be beautiful massage to have in in winter with all of those.

Clara Bailey 17:50
And doing it before… in Ayurveda they talk a lot about doing that before getting into like a warm bath and it just sounds very luxurious and beautiful. Beautiful.

Alison Mitchell 18:01
Sesame oil is so nutritive. It’s so full of antioxidants. That would be lovely thing for someone with dry skin. In my infant massage classes we recommend sesame oil as been one of the best ones to use because it has got so many benefits for dry skin and healing eczema in little bubby’s and provides so many nutrients. So it just fits all those kind of things that you said have a dry constitution. So just needing needing nutrients and making the soothing.

Clara Bailey 18:32
Yes, and I yeah, exactly internally and externally. And I mean, yeah, and I mean I love how you can like dial up and down dial down this perspective on like little bubs like a little bug that’s quietly you know, eczema just like giving like the parents like an idea, okay, like little one is just in a state of dryness, just think about moisturizing and it just reframes things in a nice way. I find.

Alison Mitchell 18:59
Yeah, as opposed to ‘there’s a disease state’ and you get fixated or worried, as opposed to getting worried about a specific diagnosis, understanding that all humans, all people have fluctuations in their health at all times in the elements sites. And so it’s bringing you back to balance.

Clara Bailey 19:18
Yeah, that’s it. And yeah, any like becoming attuned to the environment like okay, like if we’ve got like the heater on or not, you know, if it’s like quite a dry environment, like considering all of that, as well.

Alison Mitchell 19:32
Yeah. Beautiful.

Clara Bailey 19:35
So after air, we’ve got the fire, the fiery constitutions, so that’s associated with more when it’s out of balance, excess heat and inflammation in the body. And, you know, the season that a lot of us will often experience you know, at least a little bit of this is of course in high summer, and something about people who have got that more fiery constitution and in Ayurveda they talk about the pitta, pitta constitution. And if you fall into this category, like, you know, there’s so many great qualities about, you know, a fiery constitution – they’ve like a lot of focus and determination and action, like fiery constitutions are great at taking action.

But if we sort of stay, you know, in that, constantly taking action and wearing ourselves out, that can be that, you know, wearing out, you know, too much heat in the body, too much inflammation that’s not being cooled and calmed. And in like a health context, like, these people are sort of more prone to allergies and, you know, insomnia which you know, in an energetic framework is just like too much activity in the entire nervous system and in the body and you know, things like skin rashes, loose stools, that kind of that kind of thing and sort of you can intuitively sort of Know what these kind of people need they need to be cooled down they need to have that you know potential irritation frustration like dissipated and grounded. So ways we can do that with food is emphasizing sour and bitter flavored foods. So things I mean and then also just things that have really cool in nature so anything green like cucumbers, melons, yoghurt. I mean the herbs and spices that are brilliant to reach for are like anything like mints, dill, like dill seeds are super cooling and Rose I just say like rose everything when you know you’re in like an exacerbated heated state. And, and then things like you know, things to pop in your tea pot would be things like licorice and chamomile and lavender and lemon balm, like it’s just about that. Yeah, creating a cool and calm environment for these people. When they’re a bit out of sorts, and it’s also super important, something I love to tell my fiery constitutional, you know, clients is taking time to rest, reset and recharge is super important. So yeah, that’s, that’s fire.

Alison Mitchell 22:20
Those all sound like delicious foods and I love the idea of including rose into your diet, something that so many people wouldn’t think to do.

Clara Bailey 22:27
I know I will actually say fire is my very much my constitution and I used to live up in northern New South Wales, which is like a very hot, hot climate when I first moved there, I didn’t quite know how I was going to get through my degree. So that’s where I went to train. And I discovered getting a coconut, like a fresh coconut. And I put a nip of rosewater in that and some mint leaves and lemon balm leaves from my garden and that cooled me down like nothing else.

Alison Mitchell 22:57
That sounds amazing.

Clara Bailey 22:59
Yeah, and then the electrolytes and the coconut water was just yeah, it was like my special cool and calm down remedy. And even, you know, speaking of like, you know, people going through that menopausal transition can often get like, you know, these exacerbated heated states and keeping a spritzer of rose water in your bag, when you know, a hot flash comes past is such a lovely thing to do as well.

Alison Mitchell 23:28
Hmm. And I love that you said that because it really opens up that discussion of how many conditions have a heat element to it. But like going even beyond a constitution beyond the person, there are things that can alter you that you want to be driving down that heat. So using that sort of spritzer would be really good for all sorts of hot heated conditions.

Clara Bailey 23:52
Yeah, especially hot, overheated little children too, that can be a nice one.

Alison Mitchell 23:57
Lovely.

Clara Bailey 23:58
Yeah, to cool them down. And yeah, so that’s Fire.

Alison Mitchell 24:03
Beautiful. Yeah. And then do you recommend more raw or cold foods for these constitutions?

Clara Bailey 24:12
Yeah. If you’re like, if you are very fiery temperament, then you’re you are constitution that’s going to be able to handle more raw food than other constitutions. Yeah, and if you’re in a really imbalanced state of too much fire, then yes, leaning towards rawness is helpful there.

Alison Mitchell 24:30
Yeah, so something like a, you know, a cucumber soup or as you were talking about before, like a raiita with a yogurt and cucumber in it might be might be a nice option with some mint or dill throughout it.

Clara Bailey 24:43
And like a gaspacho.

Alison Mitchell 24:46
For some people like that might be handy to have a little fire remedy in the cupboard.

Clara Bailey 24:51
Yeah, exactly. You don’t like if you’ve got a significant other or somebody in your family who’s like a fire like do not serve curry if they’re a bit out of sorts

Alison Mitchell 25:02
Yeah, and that old saying of having a curry or having something spicy would cool you down because it makes you sweat. Does that go a little bit against this concept?

Clara Bailey 25:13
No, no, no, that is true, actually. I mean that that gets like a little bit more into the like deeper… I mean, I forget the term. It’s like a Sanskrit term, but they talk about plants having a primary action in the secondary action. So something like Chilli has a primary action of heat, but it heats so much that it opens up the peripheries like so the sweat glands, so then you sweat and then you cool down. So then it’s got a secondary cooling effect. Something like Turmeric is really heating but it cools down inflammation. So because herbs are just working in these beautiful dynamic ways all the time aren’t they, and so it’s this way like the instinct with it comes in but yeah, to an extent having chilli just to break the heat. Sort of rebalance the constitution can be helpful.

Alison Mitchell 26:03
Almost like a pressing the reset button.

Clara Bailey 26:07
Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Kinda like how people go for like this ice, you know ice swimming in the winter and it really like invigorates the whole system and makes them quite resilient.

Alison Mitchell 26:17
Yeah, I have not brought myself to do that. I know there’s a lot of research behind those being beneficial at the moment but yeah, I’m too so much of a loss. I think that I might be a little bit on a colder constitution. So…

Clara Bailey 26:31
yeah, probably know the middle of summer for you to play around with that idea.

Alison Mitchell 26:37
And you were talking about how where you are has a bit of an impact to this too, so I guess, even though you might find that you are a certain constitution or a type. You’re always going to have different experiences within these as well. So you’re not always going to be a wetter type or a dry type or hot type or something like that. Because you might have go traveling and you go, okay, like, I’m actually expressing a little bit more of that. So that’s that’s really good to know too.

Clara Bailey 27:07
Yeah, exactly. Like, we gotta like our base note, and then everything can be like iterated on there, huh? Okay.

Alison Mitchell 27:17
That’s fire.

Clara Bailey 27:18
That’s heat, that’s fire and then yeah, and then we move on to the opposite of that, which is Earth and like, coldness is associated with Earth. So this is like, instead of a over function, like, too much expression, this is like his depression of function. Everything’s like a bit of a lowered activity. There’s like an under stimulation going on, and like us, you know, clinicians when we see people like that we’re often be thinking about like, Okay, I’m thinking about, they’ve probably got sluggish circulation or you know, always thinking about like, okay, how’s the thyroid doing because, you know, our thyroids govern you know, that thermostat, you know, in our bodies, and often if we’re tending towards always coldness that would lend to some of those things. But there’s like plenty of things you can do just in your home, that can help just warm up the body. But I mean, when you’re out of balance, and you’re really in that cold state, it’s you know, everything is slow. So feeling like a low mood feeling fatigued, potentially, like slower bowels like tending towards more constipation, cold hands and feet, maybe even like a blue or purple tinge to them. Just again, all that the sort of poor circulation stuff. And often also like brain fog, if you know too much with it are fiery people, they can get maybe a bit hyper focused or over focus, whereas if you’re in that cold state, it’s just hard to get everything sparking and going. And so and we often feel this in the depths of winter don’t really like it’s like, I just am feeling Like, slow and just want everything to spark back up again.

Alison Mitchell 29:06
For sure

Clara Bailey 29:07
what we want here is like aromatics and our warming foods. So, like, I mean, basically a nice way to just distill it in a simple way is Chai spices. Oh yeah, put it in a chai pot. So I mean, what do you like to put it in your tie?

Alison Mitchell 29:29
I I tend to have a ready made one but I particularly like cinnamon and cardamon, they’re the flavors that stand out to me, and a little bit of clove.

Clara Bailey 29:38
Yes. Very good. Yeah, clove always gets things moving. Yeah, so yeah, and you’re nutmegs and black peppers.

Alison Mitchell 29:48
I think I’ve got a bit of kapha. I tend to fluctuate between a few of them, but I have a little bit of kapaha, a little bit of pitta. And I think the things that I tend to quite like is your Rosemary and Chilli, like things that are going to be like quite stimulating as well

Clara Bailey 30:05
so that any of those Mediterranean herbs too, so your Rosemary’s and bay leaves, and sage and Oregano are those all superheating I mean, another thing like about a cold state is that there’s that can be that predilection to like getting infections easily like picking up colds and flus, and like having, you know, using all those spices and herbs liberally and your food is such a good way to keep, you know, all those bugs at bay.

Alison Mitchell 30:37
And, you know, I guess, like my understanding of it is that if you’re of a different constitution, it’s not that you have to avoid those spices. It’s more so that they are a particular benefit to other types. Would that sound right?

Clara Bailey 30:51
Sorry, it just it just a little robot move on me.

Alison Mitchell 30:54
Oh no. I’m saying is that, That the feeling that I get is that sometimes it’s not that we have to avoid these spices or foods if you are a different constitution, but just that they are a particular benefit for that particular constitution that we’re talking about.

Clara Bailey 31:13
Exactly. Yeah. And I think, totally, totally Yeah, it’s definitely not creating like, Oh, you’ve got a hot constitution. So avoid all heating spices.

Alison Mitchell 31:23
Yeah.

Clara Bailey 31:24
It’s more like, if you are, if you are hot constitution, and it’s in the middle of summer, like, you’re probably going to enjoy that coconut water with the rose water more than you were going for a really hot steaming cup of Chai. Yeah. Yeah. And then, you know, visa versa, if you’re that cold constitution. So I guess, like, the real guiding principle of all of this is just like, becoming that like, you know, awakening that kitchen, witch if have, like, if you’re feeling really out of balance, you’ve just got this really cool set of principles to draw upon to bring you back into balance, rather than this becoming like Another rule book of how to like structure, you know, your health and well being.

Alison Mitchell 32:04
Yeah, like do this and don’t do that. It’s more about how exactly, and I love that term Kitchen Witch, that is so cool.

Clara Bailey 32:12
Yeah, that’s actually become quite a part of my vocabulary these days actually. I think we all have an inner kitchen witch that lacks to be evoked.

And then and then we put our final element, which is one that potentially doesn’t get used as much when I talk about this often, but it makes complete sense to people but it’s like something that hasn’t been heard as much. At least in western idea.

Alison Mitchell 32:42
I admit it’s not one that is in my line of thinking about constitutions, but I’m so excited to hear what you say about it.

Clara Bailey 32:51
Yeah, so I mean, ether is the element of space. So, like literally just spaciousness, so Like beyond the earth, excellent, you know, expanse. And so when there is a lack of space, in the body, we have tension. And in the Ayuverdic constitutions like Vata is part cold part ether. And that really differentiates them from a kapha, which is part cold part earth. So with that ether element, you know, that can just be that internal tension, it can be that state of like getting cramps and spasms. And, you know, I feel like it’s actually like a pretty, you know, if you live in a city that’s really busy, you were quite predisposed to have an imbalance of this element. Yeah, because it’s just all about the nervous system taking over. And when it’s, you know, has been maybe working a little bit too hard over time. So, I mean, really, and this Yeah, and this is just, it’s equally about like Psychological tension, as it is physical tension with this element.

Alison Mitchell 34:04
It makes so much sense when you do say it. And I remember Dennis Stewart, who’s a herbalist, he says that we’re becoming a vatagenic society. And I guess that’s because Vata is like, you know, high strung and anxious but, but the way that you’re talking about constitution says things a lot more broader than just like, the ayurvedic constitutions that you’ve got all these other things in there and so ether makes so much more sense, because that’s, that’s probably more what’s going on then. Then, what what we just said.

Clara Bailey 34:35
Yeah, I mean, I don’t know about you. I just feel like everyone I speak to with with there’s like this chronic sense of like, lack of time, lack of space, lack of lack, you know, everything’s feeling pressured. And we sort of got like, kind of thing contained from all angles.

Alison Mitchell 34:51
Yeah, I definitely resonate with that one.

Clara Bailey 34:53
Yeah, yeah. And I think Dennis to its right on the money. I see. I think, yeah. People have got to get to the ether imbalance going on? Yeah, maybe that’s why holidays are really good. ..into space.

Alison Mitchell 35:09
Yeah. Yeah.

Clara Bailey 35:12
So I mean, so there’s like plenty of like, I mean, way to balance this element, I mean, mostly is like doing your best to slow down and like the breath, you know, ether is very much associated with our breath. And if we can, you know, pranayama is so good for bringing ourselves, you know, into balance with this element. And I often see, you know, people who’ve got that very Ethery constitution, they’re the people that often really love, like smoking is potentially more the thing that, you know, is the thing that they like comes from down.

Alison Mitchell 35:47
Interesting

Clara Bailey 35:48
And that I’ve seen that Yeah, I’ve seen that correlation. Quite a bit. Just kept breathing is just a calming exercise to do and being able to focus on that So, you know, so instead of like tobacco just get taking a moment to do you know, it’s like a simple deep breathing or you can get a bit fancy with some. Yeah, yogic stuff. It’s like a really quick one to do.

Alison Mitchell 36:13
Yeah, there’s so many different techniques. But it’s all so powerful.

Clara Bailey 36:19
But what I like about this elemental way of thinking about it is like, you know, whether it’s like working like as a practitioner and trying to work out like a really nice self care tool kit to, you know, be creating, co creating with a client or if you’re creating your own self care. knowing what’s going to bring that constitution into balance is really cool. So with a cold person, if, you know, they’re in a state of like, mental upset, or feeling a bit out of sorts, you know, their solution might be like, go out into the sun and walk and call a friend or a loved one, versus somebody who’s in that a three, you know, tense state Like, go to a yoga class and make sure there’s plenty of pranayama in there and just like, do what you need to do to feel that space in your body and in your, you know, in your in a world.

Alison Mitchell 37:11
Yeah, that makes so much sense. Like, I know that I often feel so much more relaxed when I you know, just go outside, just sit on the ground.

Clara Bailey 37:21
Yeah, and take your shoes off.

Alison Mitchell 37:24
Yeah, and get some grounding happening.

Clara Bailey 37:26
Grounding get Yeah, like aligning yourself with that elements that you’ve got that, you know, deep constitutional affinity with. And, you know, I mean, it all sounds like, you know, like kind of poetic. But where I find this comes into its own is in this wellness landscape we’re in at the moment, where there’s just so much information and so many lists of things that you can do to self treat. And, you know, but when you overlay it with an elemental framework, things just come into play. life the way you are in that moment, a lot more elegantly and precisely.

Alison Mitchell 38:05
Yeah, that’s beautiful. And it’s also just things that you can just be more empowered about doing as well rather than feeling like the answer is always external.

Clara Bailey 38:14
Yeah, or that the answer is like, it’s because my serotonin is low, and it’s like, I’m having like, an inflamed reaction to gluten. And I can imagine the, like, inflammatory compounds circulating around my body, you know, like, I feel like we’re falling into a little bit of like, of that thinking as a culture. This is like, oh, okay, my fire element is added, like a bit out of balance, like, it’s gonna have some like cooling foods and downtime.

Alison Mitchell 38:42
And I guess, maybe gluten is causing some inflammation, but you don’t have to think about it like that. Because then you tend to get that sort of mind overload and you don’t, you don’t have to get into the nitty gritty of it. That’s, you know, that’s the job of a practitioner to really work out those kinks for you. But even they have All this constitutional stuff, it actually is so powerful, isn’t it? And yeah, gluten might be a factor, but it still comes down to that base level of doing what’s right for you.

Clara Bailey 39:10
Yeah, exactly. And just, yeah, reframing it to be like what is most nourishing to me what is like? Yeah. And then knowing those triggers and yeah, but with that, like having to shoulder the burden of trying to work out what it is when you haven’t had the training for that, and everything can feel like a bit scary. So coming back to the language of our ancestors and the elements I feel is just such a refreshing way to frame it for yourself.

Alison Mitchell 39:41
So it sounds a lot like with ether, there is a lot of things that you can do lifestyle wise, like stretching and breathing. Is there any moves that you’re more beneficial?

Clara Bailey 39:52
Yes. So anything rich in minerals and electrolytes really like and like All those magnesium rich foods because all those minerals is what our nervous system and our muscles need to contract and relax smoothly. So that can be like that can be getting yourself some really beautiful quality salt like a Himalayan salt or Celtic salts or Black River Salt Lake whatever it is like you want like not a table salt and doing you know something like with like avocado on like a toast of your choice with like a nice heavy helping have that like good quality salt. Or like I mentioned before, like the coconut water or anything that’s got a lot of those trace minerals will seaweeds is really helpful. And then anything green like you know, like anything green equals magnesium.

Alison Mitchell 40:48
That’s a great way to remember

Clara Bailey 40:49
basically, yeah, I’ll spare maybe your listeners are going into the geeks, geeky things of chlorophyll, versus haemoglobin. It’s a nice, easy, simple way to, to look at it yet, like you, you know and taking an actual magnesium supplement, if you are in that really eastery state, you know, really tense in your body really feeling tense and stressed in your mind is, you know, such a simple nutrient that can have such like profound impacts quickly. Can’t it.

Alison Mitchell 41:24
Yeah, for sure. I love magnesium and it has such a broad range of actions but very powerful.

Clara Bailey 41:30
Yeah, again, I think it’s so popular now because we are all in this a bit in this state.

And then, yeah, and then just a few other things that are really nice. The ether people is like warm, salty bonds, like having a nice, like Epson salt bath. We’d like not just like a little half cup of Epsom salts like putting in like a good two cups, and maybe even doing like a special Scrub with an oil beforehand. Yes, today.

Alison Mitchell 42:05
That sounds great. And I’ve heard of salt scrubs being kind of a daily ritual been really helpful as a protective thing to, like quite a nice sort of way to, you know, shed off negative energies. And so doing that in the shower could be quite good.

Clara Bailey 42:21
Yeah, that’s something about salt, isn’t it? Whenever I have a really salty bath, it’s, yeah, it’s guaranteed a very deep sleep.

Alison Mitchell 42:31
Pretty, pretty awesome. So I guess that sounds like a really great review of all the different constitutions, but finding out or working out for a person how to actually navigate the foods around there. That takes a little bit of the next step, doesn’t it? And so, what I would love for you to talk about now is how people can eat intuitively.

Clara Bailey 42:55
Yeah. So so the space of intuitive is something that I just discovered recently in the last 12 months. But I really feel like it is just such a missing link or like or a final link, actually. So I mean, it’s basically the principle of reframing the way that you nourish yourself of like aligning your body’s needs with, you know, with your, like spirit and your heart really and allowing yourself like allowing ourselves to, like rely on our instincts rather than trying to work out what we need from our head all the time. So it’s a philosophy that really helps us move away from like, rigid external rules against around like, what’s good or bad, like what’s clean, what’s toxic, you know, all these kind of words that you know, setting up this black and white, which, you know, it can be really easy to get into that thinking especially if you have had food triggers or, you know, changing your diet has actually made a big impact on your healing. And so I just found myself as a naturopath like, wondering, I was doing a lot of good with putting people on therapeutic food plans, but I was beginning to notice people getting maybe a little bit mentally stressed about it, or becoming a bit mentally rigid about it and it impacting other areas of their life. So even though there was all better, and this skin problem, it cleared up for the periods when I’m back on track, you know, there was this, sometimes there was this other element and I have found, you know, this framework has really helped to navigate that and put a really nice set of principles for people to work with to do that final step.

Alison Mitchell 44:45
Yeah, I love that idea. Because I see it too, that people are so afraid of stepping backwards in their health and you know, you’ve got some results in whatever you’re prescribed a particular diet for, but it’s then the next step. That’s that real scary. area, and you do, but you don’t want to cause stress.

Clara Bailey 45:04
So the last thing you want to do, and and we of course want to leave up, you know, our patients are, you know, farther off than before they came in, you know, source. I mean, it’s beyond the scope of this conversation that I know orthorexia is that term for… You know, I believe it’s now I think, just recently, the DSM, which is like that official, psychological framework for making diagnoses has, you know, it’s been recognized as an actual diagnosis, and it’s just the obsession of healthy eating. And, yeah, and I think, you know, as practitioners in the holistic space have got a great responsibility to make sure that doesn’t happen.

Alison Mitchell 45:48
Yeah, that’s right.

Clara Bailey 45:50
Yeah. So, I mean, so how this links with elemental framework is that it’s all about it’s all about senses, right? Like instant intuition and coming into learning to listen to our body and then being able to honor its needs rather than, you know, doing what we think our body needs, and then obeying the rules. You know, there’s quite a distinction between those two ways of approaching our wellness. And, you know, there has to be a caveat here because, you know, some people who have got, like celiac disease, or they truly do have, you know, a reaction to a food like that’s different, you know, that’s in a different category here. Or if you know that there’s been like a food trigger, and that, you know, that’s really taking that food out is really what’s allowed you to gain traction on your health. But if it’s more than that, you know, you feel better off those foods. It’s sort of working out what is the new, like, what is that new terrain? Like? How is it about an amount of it that actually is it a threshold thing And so then just taking away this idea of, you know, restriction and a binary model of like, Oh no, I can’t have that ever to being like, No, I am not having that food right now because I know it doesn’t make me feel good, but maybe it will one day. So just like being a bit more fluid at that at all.

And yeah, I mean, really, the essence of it is coming away from rigidity and just coming into what feels nourishing to you right now.

Alison Mitchell 47:32
It’s almost a bit more compassionate to yourself as well isn’t it.

Clara Bailey 47:36
Oh 100% yeah. Yeah, it’s love and compassion. Like that’s, that’s you hit the nail on the head. Yes. I mean, I’m sure do you find this in your practice? Like, I mean, as a culture we have we have so many crazy ideas around food, you know, when you start disentangling what people have absorbed over the years.

Alison Mitchell 48:02
Yeah, I, I’ve seen many different things I’ve been blessed, but it can’t even find that things can get taken a little out of hand. And I probably have seen it less in my patients than just observing things, I’m sure of it. Because, like, that’s when you tend to see people who get the fad diet going on and are preaching it to other peoples in that. So one of the things that I imagine you get asked quite a lot when you’re recommending intuitive eating, is that just this just mean that, you know, I feel like chocolate cake, so therefore, I want chocolate cake. And that’s good for me. And that that sort of thing. Like, does that mean people are going to give into their cravings.

Clara Bailey 48:40
It’s such a good question and it’s one that you can sort of look at it in a few ways. I mean, so one of them is, in the beginning, when you know, taking on an intuitive eating approach with clients, like often I’ll say to them, like, Look, you know, there’ll be a learning period here and it might feel a bit unstable at the beginning. I forget who said it somebody who’s one of the sort of leaders in this intuitive eating movement of that how it’s like a pendulum swinging from diet land to donut land. And when you you know, if you’ve been in a restricted mindset for a long time, when you when you open when you like release the structures, it can be easy to like, you know, swing all the way over to back to that other side. But it’s actually about, you know, trusting in the process and allowing that pendulum to find its middle ground of where it’s happy. So that’s one part of it. And just to anticipate, you know, and, I mean, the whole thing has been like, okay, it’ll the chocolate cake and maybe you won’t feel so great after it. Like, you know, feeling that like, because all of this is about making me feel good. And then the other side of it is if there is you know, some kind of a food is being used as an emotional crutch, if it is, you know, it is something that is reached for if you know, feeling saturon you know, or vulnerable or whatever it may be, then you know, having that compassion with yourself to just see that as a really great signpost like all okay? When I am really, you know, reaching for comfort food, food or volumes of food or you know, it might be I don’t want to eat because I’m feeling x, y and Zed. Like, that gives you a really clear insight into how you’re feeling and feel, you know, working with the guidance and the support of the practitioner that can give you some really nice insights that will help you on ultimately that healing journey and coming to peace with food and, you know, ultimately, you know, functioning at a, you know, happy optimal level. So, it’s it’s, so yeah, again, it just comes back to compassion and a lot of trust as well. I feel trust conversation a lot with people around this.

Alison Mitchell 50:54
Yeah, that’s, that’s really interesting point. But such a good one. yeah, I love that idea. And then.

Clara Bailey 51:02
And just I mean, the final like the final kind of bow that ties all of this together is this concept of and it’s like the final principle in intuitive eating is gentle nutrition. And it’s like, Okay, take that information about what we know, constitutes a great, you know, like great balance of nourishment. Take what you know about what foods like can like alarm your system and what foods you find really calming and nourishing. and use that as your framework and allow yourself to move within it and experiment within it. And you know, if you’ve got that map of the elements and elemental eating, if you’ve got that sense of trust in your body and trust, of just like allowing yourself to enjoy your food and allow yourself to desire allow yourself to, you know, it just, it brings all your senses back online. That’s just part of your well being. So that’s why I just love it as a, as a as a framework to work in.

Alison Mitchell 52:10
I think that sounds amazing. And I’m imagining that if you’ve got a strict diet in front of you, it’s like you’re going on a highway, and you’re going somewhere in a straight line. And it’s not particularly interesting. Whereas you’ve got money said it’s like a map of an area that you can work within. And then you go on this little adventure with your diet and you get to a little bit of an area that is a bit scary or not very comfortable. But then you get to see all these amazing areas of the world that are just so good for you and find the delicious.

Clara Bailey 52:39
exactly, totally , it’s like you got a terrain to explore. And here’s a map.

Alison Mitchell 52:49
And I love the way that it’s all comes down to knowing yourself and knowing knowing what your constitution is and then knowing what tools you can do for yourself. And then Having, like you said that trust and that love and compassion for yourself and having the tools to do all those things with food, but also with your lifestyle as well.

Clara Bailey 53:10
Exactly. Yeah, yeah. Now I couldn’t have said it better myself.

Alison Mitchell 53:15
If people desire to know more about all of these sorts of content, where can they go to get more information on this?

Clara Bailey 53:25
So I really recommend I mean, the, in terms of the intuitive eating, I really recommend the work of Evelyn Tribole and Elyse Resch. They’re the ones that wrote the the sort of the seminal book, they’ve pioneered this area. And they’ve got, you know, they’ve got the book and they’ve got like a workbook with like a 10 week kind of journaling self inquiry process. So I would really recommend that I would also really recommend the work of Laura Thomas, who is a dietitian in the UK, and she’s just really fun. And makes all of this really accessible. And she’s written a book called Just Eat It, which released last year. So she’s a really great one too. She probably makes it like a bit more accessible to the millennial generation I feel. And then in terms of elemental eating, Maya Tiwari that’s MAYA TIWARI. She does such a beautiful job with the Ayurvedic side. But she, she breaks it down into these elemental principles as well. And her work is very beautiful and in depth and she has like shopping lists and things that you can keep on your fridge that gives you those elemental frameworks. So he would get some of those that would have you well set up. Okay.

Alison Mitchell 54:49
Well, I’ll pop the links for those in in the show notes.

Clara Bailey 54:53
Perfect.

Alison Mitchell 54:55
Thank you. Thank you so much.

Clara Bailey 54:58
What a pleasure. My pleasure. And it’s been wonderful.

Alison Mitchell 55:03
If people would like to get in contact with you, how can they do that?

Um, so if you’re if you wanted to join my email community, I write a fortnightly newsletter on all these kinds of subjects. You can go to mediatrixwellness.com.au. And there’s, you’ll be able to find a spot to sign up for with that. And I also hang out on Instagram of it. So I’m Clara Bailey double underscore, or then.

Awesome. And you do have a beautiful Instagram and you share valuable tips. So I definitely recommend everyone go and check it out.

So, thank you so much again for all sharing all your wonderful information. It’s been such a lovely time chatting, yes, likewise, and thank you for everything. Thank you.

Yeah, it’s such a pleasure. Alright, well, thank you, everyone. If you’ve enjoyed today, please go on and leave us a review. And if you have anything you’d like to hear about in the future, please don’t hesitate to ask. Right. Thank you everyone. Bye bye

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

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Guts and Girl Bits Podcast #42 with Renae Bartlett

If you’ve just had a baby, chances are you’re feeling tired and worn out. But what is that feeling is not just normal Mum fatigue, but instead a sign that something else is a bit out of balance.

The thyroid is a delicate, butterfly shaped gland that sits on your neck. It is responsible for your metabolism, and when it goes out of whack you can feel tired, cold, depressed and you can experience things like hair loss and dry skin. Sometimes the thyroid can become too overactive, which can make you feel irritable and cranky and cause unwanted weight loss.

During pregnancy and early motherhood your thyroid glands are sensitive to changes in your immune system and nutritional status, and so this is a time where your thyroid is susceptible to having issues.

In this episode I chat with nutritionist Renae Bartlett about her journey with postpartum thyroiditis, what women need to look out for, how to get screened if you suspect an issue, and we discuss some of the ways you can support your thyroid health as a new mother through your diet.

The Podcast

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Renae Bartlett is a Clinical Nutritionist who until 12 months ago, was based in Adelaide South Australia. She is currently residing in Canada for the next two years with her husband, one year old daughter and their dog Diego. Renae assists people by focussing heavily on the fundamental basics of using ‘food first’ for healing, health and wellbeing. Renae was diagnosed with Hashimoto’s in 2016 and Post-Partum Thyroiditis following the birth of their daughter in 2018. This has led Renae down a path focussed on helping women who may have been diagnosed with post-partum thyroiditis, or who are at risk of developing this condition.

https://www.instagram.com/rebornhealthnutrition/

http://www.rebornhealth.com.au/

https://www.facebook.com/RebornHealthNutrition/

Podcast Transcript

Alison Mitchell 0:05
Hi everyone, you’re listening to Guts and Girl Bits. I’m Alison Mitchell a practicing Naturopath. I hope to share with you all sorts of information about women’s health and digestive health to educate and empower you to make informed choices about your own health. Please remember that only information is general and does not replace consulting with a practitioner.

You’re listening to Gut’s and Girl Bits. Today I’m joined with Renae Bartlett, who is a clinical nutritionist who until 12 months ago was based in Adelaide, South Australia. She’s currently residing in Canada for the next two years with her husband, one year old daughter and their dog Diego, and she assists people by focusing heavily on the fundamental basics of using food first for healing, health and well being. Renee was diagnosed with Hashimotos in 2016, and postpartum thyroiditis, following the birth of her Daughter in 2018. This has led Renae down a path focused on helping women who hope may have been diagnosed with postpartum thyroiditis, or who are at risk of developing this condition. So thank you so much for joining me today.

Renae Bartlett 1:14
Thanks, Alison. I’m really glad to be able to speak with you today and your podcast.

Alison Mitchell 1:19
Yay. So let’s start with some basics. So what’s the thyroid gland responsible for in the body.

Renae Bartlett 1:27
So it’s a very important organ that’s part of the body. So it’s part of the endocrine system and its role is centered around producing the hormones that control the metabolism of all of ourselves. So to put that in simple terms, so some of the body functions that it’s involved in is breathing, regulating our heart rate, regulating body weight and body temperature, menstrual cycles, brain function, mood, just to name a few Very, very important organ that’s part of our body.

Alison Mitchell 2:04
Yes, so important so much.

Renae Bartlett 2:06
Yes, a lot.

Alison Mitchell 2:09
All right, and then let’s talk about what is postpartum thyroiditis.

Renae Bartlett 2:15
So postpartum thyroiditis, if we look at the two terms separately, so thyroid-itis means inflammation of the thyroid and postpartum being post pregnancy. So essentially it is a inflammation of the thyroid as a result of having a baby and it causes both hyperthyroidism, so overactive and hypo thyroidism. So an underactive thyroid with hyperthyroid or even happening at first in that instance. So, the main the main difference between postpartum thyroiditis and say other inflammation conditions of the thyroid is that it’s that pregnancy that really triggers it.

Alison Mitchell 3:06
Okay. And how common is it?

Renae Bartlett 3:09
So it’s believed that it’s between five to 10% of all pregnant women will be diagnosed with this condition. But a point tonight is it’s often misdiagnosed. And the reason for this is the symptoms can be very similar to those that are women may experience just by virtue of having a baby. So, for example, you know, the the things such as being fatigued, losing hair, insomnia, weight fluctuations, can easily be attributed to just having a baby when in fact, it may actually be postpartum thyroiditis.

Alison Mitchell 3:49
Yeah. So many of those things people would just get dismissed about like it’s just because you’re a mom, or something along those lines, but it could be so much more.

Renae Bartlett 3:58
Absolutely. And postnatal depression is also something that can be closely linked to postpartum thyroiditis. So it may in fact be the thyroid that’s causing the depression state rather than depression as an as an isolated incident. So, even though it’s five to 10%, it may actually be be more than that.

Alison Mitchell 4:21
For sure, yeah. And how do you go about getting it tested.

Renae Bartlett 4:27
So it’s simply a blood test after having a baby. Important to note that symptoms generally won’t start until about six weeks after having a baby. So it’s probably important to speak to clinician about the independent factors that may require the blood test at certain times. But generally recommendation would be around about that. Two month period postpartum and then monitoring after that.

Alison Mitchell 4:57
So if say a woman has been feeling Okay for the early stages of the postpartum period, and then she starts to feel a bit more downhill is that way you’d be thinking maybe it’s the thyroid connection,

Renae Bartlett 5:09
it could very well way and it’s just simply a blood test that it there’s nothing terribly invasive about really saying whether someone may have a thyroid condition after having a baby. And it can simply confirm whether that is something that needs to be further looked at and treated, or it can, it can then be be lumped into another condition and go down that path. So I would certainly recommend for women who have had a baby to have their thyroid tested, regardless after they’ve had had their baby, but certainly those that are in the risk group of developing the condition.

Alison Mitchell 5:50
And does your thyroid function actually changed during pregnancy as well like is this process starting earlier than postpartum?

Renae Bartlett 5:59
So Things happen a lot with pregnancy and the thyroid, think of it like a stress test for your thyroid when you fall pregnant. And the reason for this is that the first trimester, the baby is 100% dependent on the woman’s thyroid. So if there’s already an underlying issue there or even a known issue of of thyroid dysfunction, the that can have have severe implications for the woman’s first trimester of pregnancy. And unfortunately, in some cases, this is where complications such as miscarriage can occur. Between because the thyroid and the body in general cannot sustain the mother let alone the baby as well. If the pregnancy does manage to continue, the baby will then start in that second trimester to use its own thyroid to function and then from about 18 to 20 weeks. The baby will then start producing time for thyroid hormones. So when you look at that, for for someone that may have dysfunction, you’ve got the first potentially 20 weeks where that that woman needs to produce enough thyroid hormones for herself and for her baby as well.

Alison Mitchell 7:19
Yeah, okay. So it’s under a lot more pressure during that period of time. Yeah. And I guess because you know, your thyroid is dependent on certain nutrients as well. So if there’s going to be a funneling of nutrients into the baby, then that’s going to be leaving the mother a bit more deficient, possibly. And then, like you said, there’s an immune involvement too. So I guess that would have an impact.

Renae Bartlett 7:47
Yeah, absolutely. So, an important thing to differentiate is the the immune system is suppressed during pregnancy to account for the fact that the body is essentially creating something that’s foreign. So some people may actually notice if they have a autoimmune condition that their symptoms tend to be a lot better when they’re pregnant in some cases, because that immune suppression, that rebound effect after pregnancy, typically from about the six weeks and certainly in postpartum thyroiditis is is what really drives this, this thyroid inflammation and it’s that rebound of the immune system kicking back in and then going into overdrive. So there really is that the two parts playing in developing this condition, certainly.

Alison Mitchell 8:39
For sure. Okay, so, we’ve talked about, you know, how some of the symptoms that are very similar to that postpartum period generally for women like insomnia and fatigue and possibly depression, are there any other symptoms that women should look out for that might suggest that they have a thyroid issue, possibly during and post pregnancy.

Renae Bartlett 9:02
Yes. So during can be incredibly difficult when you’re just looking at symptoms. And that is because the symptoms are very similar to those that you would experience as a result of being pregnant. So for example, there can be weight changes, typically, weight gain, there can be lack of sleep, there can be irritability, anxiety, there can be mood changes, there can be skin and nail changes. So dry skin, brittle nails, all of those are quite common symptoms in particularly hypothyroid saints, but also their common symptoms that you get when you’re pregnant. Right. So, diagnosing during pregnancy is most often by blood tests, but that usually is monitoring the thyroid to see how it is coping with pregnant. Certainly after pregnancy, if a woman is in that hyperthyroid state, she’s going to experience things like increased heart rate. That could be tremors, heart palpitations, overheating, heat intolerance, insomnia, irritability, anxiety. And then when the condition swings to hyperthyroid, if that does occur, then it goes the other way. So things like fatigue, hair loss, poor memory, constipation, cold intolerance and depression are some of the main things that you would say. Okay.

Alison Mitchell 10:43
So the blood test that we’d be looking at is that typically your TSH and if that’s out of balance, then your T3, T4 and your thyroid antibodies is fairly similar to your standard thorough tests.

Renae Bartlett 10:56
Yeah, that’s correct. Yeah. Okay.

Alison Mitchell 11:00
Are there any predisposing factors for developing past postpartum thyroiditis?

Renae Bartlett 11:05
Yeah, there is. So there’s certainly a strong link between having thyroid autoimmunity before pregnancy. So typically the the TPO antibodies. Also there’s a history of thyroid dysfunction previously, and that can even be transients or may not even be be permanent. If there’s been a family history of any thyroid disorders, or a previous history of postpartum thyroiditis in another pregnancy, and also other autoimmune disorders, particularly type one diabetes, they’re at high ris k of developing this condition.

Alison Mitchell 11:51
Okay. And so it is something that does tend to recur so like if you’ve had it one pregnancy, you’re likely to get it another time.

Renae Bartlett 12:00
Not necessarily at the moment, it’s estimated that about 20% of recurring. So that is some good news that it doesn’t mean that for every pregnancy a woman is necessarily going to continue to have postpartum thyroiditis. It may be one time timeline in which is good news as for that, that 20% it tends to be women that have very high anti thyroid antibodies, where their TSH levels are not in the normal range when they fell pregnant, so certainly about about five I believe or even above 10 and that that is the most likely risk factor for perhaps having it recur.

Alison Mitchell 12:51
Okay. Now, I know that you’ve had a bit of a journey yourself with this, is it something that you would be able to share Your journey with postpartum thyroiditis?

Renae Bartlett 13:02
Yes, certainly. So, I was aware that I had a pre existing thyroid condition before I fell pregnant. And I did have some some difficulties falling pregnant. And I do believe it was it was probably due to my thyroid condition. So once I was successful in falling pregnant, I made sure that I monitored my thyroid levels throughout pregnancy. And I wasn’t on any thyroid medication either. So it was more to just make sure that my body was handling it appropriately. Thankfully, it was everything went along really, really well. I had a really wonderful pregnancy, wonderful birth. And then after having my baby at about three months postpartum, I felt generally quite well but I thought I really need to go and just make sure that my thyroid is functioning as it should. And knowing that I had a previous history I thought that would be a good idea. As it turned out, I was very hypothyroid. Much to the surprise to myself and my, my doctor, because I wasn’t really presenting with very strong symptoms, which I came to find is relatively common. It’s more of a hypothyroid state. If it does swing to that word becomes quite known that there may be an issue. And so I monitored my bloods every four weeks, and I believe after about two months, I then transitioned into hypothyroid. And I did then certainly start to notice symptoms. For me, I had extreme fatigue. I would say quite Moody, you know, crying without really understanding what I was crying about. I can remember one day I was out walking my dog and it was a beautiful day and I started crying and I’m like, Why on earth? am I crying? This is not know. I don’t really understand what’s going on. So luckily for me, I knew that it wasn’t just as a result of having a baby and I knew that wasn’t me going crazy and thinking, you know what? What’s going on? I knew that it was my thyroid driving this and I think that really helped me in dealing with it appropriately and just letting my body try and regulate itself, rather than trying to figure out what was wrong with me, in an essence, so I thought, quite lucky that I managed to do that. And then I ended up deciding to take thyroxine because I felt as though I was lucky that my symptoms were okay but I didn’t know how bad I could get and given my history of having a thyroid condition, I thought it best to go that action. And my doctor said, You know what, let’s, let’s give it a go. And if it’s at a time we feel it appropriate, we can see if we can when you offer and take it off and see how your body handles. So I really liked that approach that, you know, we can just try and manage it how we can and then and then see how my body adapts to it at some point, so. So yeah, that’s kind of been my, my journey with it so far.

Alison Mitchell 16:30
Well, thank you for sharing that. Yeah. And I love how much you were trusting your own body to go through those processes as well.

Renae Bartlett 16:37
Yes, sometimes you’ve just got to take your hand off the wheel, I think and just let it do its thing.

Alison Mitchell 16:42
Yeah. So did you find that it affects breastfeeding?

Renae Bartlett 16:49
I was very fortunate that it didn’t affect my milk supply. I was able to breastfeed and I still am now. My baby will be one in two weeks. So thankfully, I am have been able to do that. But it certainly can affect milk production and is a common symptom in women that have thyroid issues. So it’s certainly can can impair that. Hmm,

Alison Mitchell 17:14
well, hooray for extended breastfeeding. I’m a big fan of that.

Renae Bartlett 17:17
Yeah. Yeah. I felt a sigh of relief when I knew that. That was something that I didn’t have to worry about. Yeah,

Alison Mitchell 17:25
yeah. But it’s so interesting, the way that it expresses differently and everyone and how this the different interplay. So it’s not just a straightforward thyroid effects product and no, it’s there’s other things involved.

Renae Bartlett 17:39
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. And you’re so right. And this is where really getting to know yourself, I could have easily spent my entire postpartum period, not even knowing that I had postpartum thyroiditis. Honestly, I really could have because you could have just easily put the things I experienced down to having a baby It’s just it just really presents so differently to any to everyone really? Yeah, symptoms really do vary.

Alison Mitchell 18:08
Yeah, and I do observe quite a lot of the time that it is uncommon to get this thorough testing done even as a general screening. And sometimes, you know, you can be having done it too early, or you might because the thyroid changes so much as well. Like sometimes you do need to repeat a TSH and go up and down and by itself, it’s not always that great an indicator, so you might need to get that complete picture of the testing with antibodies.

Renae Bartlett 18:37
Yeah, absolutely.

Alison Mitchell 18:40
Alright, so knowing what you know now, like say, theoretically if you were to have another bubby. would you do anything to look after your thyroid, preconception or during pregnancy to try and prevent this from happening or, or how would you advise other women to look after their thyroid to prevent it.

Renae Bartlett 19:01
Yeah, so that’s a really good question. Because I have looked back and gone ‘What What could I have done?’ I was really good at at having having a really great, very varied diet you know, a good amount of vegetables, fruits, quality protein fats, I started taking a really good quality prenatal vitamin, three months before pregnancy, fish oil, all of that. The one thing that I didn’t do that I would be really interested to see how that would go and that is taking a supplement of selenium. And the reason why I say Selenium is there has been some clinical studies done that shows some promise in that Selenium supplementation during pregnancy. Even with women that has positive antibodies does significantly reduce the risk of postpartum thyroiditis so I caution that we saying further studies need to be done and certainly it’s not the be all and end all that you know, you take Selenium and you’ll be fine but it is quite promising to show that that nutrient did show some improvements in a study that was done I believe in 2011 so that’s one thing that I didn’t do and I think that’s something that I would I would probably look at and I doing with my next pregnancy

Alison Mitchell 20:35
Yeah, it’s interesting and you know, there’s a lot of multivitamins out there that are pregnancy targeted that have virtually like, you know, very little Selenium in them. Yeah, taking a better quality multivitamin is advisable and or taking some additional selenium anymore. At the very least, I guess eating more Selenium rich foods. but that’s so hard to do, isn’t it? Because

Renae Bartlett 21:01
Yeah,

Alison Mitchell 21:03
A bit hit and miss in foods.

Renae Bartlett 21:05
It is and it varies so MUCH. And then of course, you know, you want to you don’t want to just be taking taking pills all the time, you know, and trying to remember to do that, especially if you’ve already got got children I’m a big advocate for trying to use food as much as you can rather than relying on supplements but with pregnancy there is that increased demand and you know, if it means that it could, could possibly help you after pregnancy then it’s it’s a it’s something worth looking at, if you if you can.

Alison Mitchell 21:42
For sure. And what sort of dosages he generally looking to work within the range of because I know that many people are a bit hesitant to do higher doses of selenium.

Renae Bartlett 21:55
Yeah, so, the study that I that I spoke about that showed some Promise the supplementation was at 200 micrograms a day. The upper limit for Selenium is often recommended for 150 micrograms per day. I feel quite comfortable that if someone wanted to try, try that under the useful direction of a qualified nutritionist or naturopath, that 200 micrograms would be suitable and ensuring that there isn’t Selenium coming from other sources that might push that too much further over the edge. I think I think that that is a safe, a safe way and actually shining in studies that it might be useful.

Alison Mitchell 22:43
Yeah. And you know, a nutritionist or a naturopath could guide you with that, I guess. Yeah, absolutely. even look at monitoring your levels through your Bloods and making sure that they’re not going in a pattern that’s a bit uncomfortable for you.

Renae Bartlett 22:57
Yeah, yeah, that’s right. Yeah. Cool.

Alison Mitchell 23:01
So are there some other areas that you often look at supporting women with postpartum thyroiditis?

Renae Bartlett 23:08
Yeah, look, stress is a huge, huge, huge factor. And I know that gets thrown around a lot. I know, you know, nearly every condition you can think of, you know, you get told look out for stress, but honestly, it is so big in driving this condition, it’s not funny and it can be so difficult. You’ve just had a baby, and then you’ve got someone telling you to Oh, you know, just don’t stress so much. And you know, look at that, yeah, that’s really great. But if there are things that you can try and do, whatever it is, whether it be five minutes of meditation just before you go to sleep, or maybe it might be just going out for a walk with your baby or maybe just catching up with some girlfriends, for coffee once a week, whatever it is, just try and do that. That whatever it is that kind of makes you feel that you can just let it out, you know, be writing things in a journal or exercising and he can, you know, all of these things really will play a part in, in trying to reduce that that cortisol and that stress that can really be making this condition a lot worse than what it should be.

Yeah, for sure.

Alison Mitchell 24:22
Yeah.

So stress is a really big one.

Renae Bartlett 24:25
Yeah, yeah. It’s huge. Yeah.

Alison Mitchell 24:30
Great. Are there any other areas that you often look at?

Renae Bartlett 24:34
So nutritionally, we’ve spoken about Selenium. There is also, I guess, when we look back at the pregnancy status is having sufficient iodine to support the thyroid function during pregnancy, and then continuing that for breastfeeding as well. That’s really important. And I think it’s often a nutrient that does get overlooked when you look at prenatal support. So that’s something that really is important. So iodine and selenium for that nutritional and then for postpartum when I look at nutrition, I like to try and simplify it and go you know you’re already trying to reduce your stress let’s not stress it out anymore by you know, throwing these hardcore diet things in there. Let’s make it really simple. You know, think of food first try and think of of getting things as fresh as possible. By you know, going and getting vegetables and fruit just starting with that getting some protein sources. Even if you need to buy frozen vegetables and and cook that up on a meal that’s perfectly fine. You know if that’s going to save you a trip to the supermarket, when you’ve got other things going on. Do that you know, if you need to keep eggs in the fridge so that you can just do some scrambled eggs for dinner. Do that, you know, try and simplify your nutritional routine. Don’t overthink it. Don’t. Don’t try to be this fantastic mom who can just do it all just simplify it, you know, as long as you’re able to eat well. With basics, you’ll be fine. You really will.

Alison Mitchell 26:27
Brilliant. Yeah, yeah. It’s so important for mothers to just eat.

Renae Bartlett 26:32
Yeah.

Alison Mitchell 26:33
Yeah. So easy to just like, you know, let that part of your life to stop because you know, you’re worried about the baby and of course, but you gotta eat.

Renae Bartlett 26:44
You do, you do have to eat and you know what, get when people come to visit you don’t get them to bring gifts of you know, more baby clothes and things like that. Tell them to bring food. Say: “Bring food! What I need, you know, that’s the best gift you can give a new Mama.” Yeah. Yeah, certainly in the month after Don’t forget, you know, they’re still trying to to raise a little human being there. So. Mm hmm. For sure.

Alison Mitchell 27:15
Yeah, for sure. And I always think about iron when it comes to thyroid health as well. Is that something that you look at?

Renae Bartlett 27:23
Yeah, absolutely. And particularly after giving birth, because women will often lose blood as a result of childbirth. So making sure that iron levels are adequate is is really important for that for the thyroid to function. Now, so yeah, that’s that is a very important nutrient. Absolutely. Yeah, for sure.

Alison Mitchell 27:46
Okay, and any, any other areas?

Renae Bartlett 27:50
So we, I guess we’ve touched a bit on nutritional and then the emotional or sorry, well, the lifestyle side of trying to reduce stress, but I think that emotional support is Well, because postpartum thyroiditis is really not known by many people, I think it’s really important to be open and honest with those in your family, your support networks, let them know that, you know, you don’t just have the baby blues that you you know, you are going through something and it can be transients at times between your symptoms, and to just get that added support. So that’s probably my my main take home is look at your emotional support. Lifestyle, you know, try and reduce your stress and nutritionally try and keep it simple by eating the best that you can when you can and don’t overcomplicate it. Yeah, for sure.

Alison Mitchell 28:44
Yeah. Okay. So, can you give some women that have having postpartum thyroiditis or worried about it, three actionable actionable steps that they can do?

Renae Bartlett 28:57
Yeah, so, I guess Further on to what I just I just mentioned then, first of all, figure out who your support network is. Talk to someone about your your condition and how you’re feeling and and really get them to help you in whatever that is for you. It may be getting someone to bring you food, it may be someone helping out with the baby might be someone to just catch up with the coffee, whatever that is. Number two, really try and figure out a way that you can reduce stress in your life. As much as that may be a difficult task for you, even if it’s just five minutes to try and have some time where you just sit there and and write in a journal, read a book, meditate, whatever it is go for a walk. It’s really important. And then third of all, really try and figure out with your nutrition, what you can do with minimal stress on yourself. So whether that Is meal planning so planning out your meals for the week and doing one shop if that works for you brilliant do it if that’s going to enable you to eat the best way you can then do it. If it’s cooking a lot of food and freezing it do that. If it’s having frozen vegetables, boiled eggs, nuts in the fridge, things that you are ready to go because maybe you’re not someone that doesn’t batch cook you’re not someone that doesn’t meal plan you just ate as you go has those things ready there for you. So try to simplify it but stick to foods that are going to give you the most nutrient dense so you know any of you vegetables, fruit quality protein sources, so eggs, meat, tofu. Lovely whole grains think of quinoa, think of making some lovely muffins with spelt, buckwheat, all of those kind of things are really going to be helpful for you. In that postpartum phase, make sure you’re ea ting.

Brilliant. All right and last question for you. What is your favorite food for thyroid health?

Okay, so this is difficult because there’s so many great ones but I’m going to have to go with the very simple egg. The reason being is it’s full of so many wonderful nutrients that are going to support your thyroid so it does have iodine, it has a lovely amount have a really lovely fats which is going to do wonders for your your skin, can do wonders for your hair, protein as well that’s going to support your immune system. And it’s such a versatile food, boil it up, have it as a snack. scramble it have it for breakfast, mixing something vegetables, all that kind of thing. So I think I’m going to go with the humble egg.

Alison Mitchell 32:04
I think that’s a great answer. Great. So thank you so much Now Renae, do you have any offerings on at the moment?

Renae Bartlett 32:14
So at the moment, I’m currently working on a couple of things within my business. So at the moment, I’m looking at putting together a series of helpful, simplified food tips. So that’ll be a compilation of videos, how to shop guides, how to cook guides, but simply for your family. I’m hoping to have that finalized within the next six to 12 months. And also some ebooks on how to look after your thyroid after having a baby.

Alison Mitchell 32:50
Beautiful. Yeah. Oh, well, that’d be so good. Yeah. Okay. Thank you. And if people want to know more, how can they get in touch with you?

Renae Bartlett 32:59
So They can get in touch with me My business is Reborn Health. So the most effective way is just send me a message on facebook Rerbon Health Nutrition. And I’m also on Instagram as well, which is also Reborn Health and Nutrition.

Alison Mitchell 33:15
Great. And I’ll put the links for those in the show notes as well.

Renae Bartlett 33:18
Great.

Alison Mitchell 33:19
So thank you so much for sharing all this wonderful information today. It’s been an absolute pleasure talking with you.

Renae Bartlett 33:26
It’s been great, thanks so much for having me.

Alison Mitchell 33:29
Yay. So thanks, everyone for listening. Please hop on and leave us a five star review. And if you have anything you want to learn about in the future, don’t hesitate to ask. So thank you, everyone.

Renae Bartlett 33:42
Bye bye.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

The post Thyroid Problems After Having a Baby appeared first on Alison Mitchell Naturopath.

How Toxin exposure can impact your hormonal health, fertility and the health of your children and grandchildren.

I’m joined with Naturopath extraordinaire Tabitha McIntosh in this episode of Guts and Girl Bits (formally ‘Health & Wellbeing Podcast’). We chat about how the chemicals* in our food and environment can impact on our health in more ways than we know.

We also chat about how chemical exposure can impact on fertility, pregnancy outcomes and can impact on the health of our children, and even our grandchildren. We also talk about how certain chemicals and pollutants can affect hormonal health and wellbeing.

But just chatting about how these chemicals can impact on our health isn’t that good unless we also talk about how to reduce your exposure and help your body to heal. Tabitha shares some of her recommendations to reduce toxin exposure to toxins and pollutants from many different sources.

Some points we cover include:

• What sort of impact is toxin exposure having on people?
• Is there an increase in defects in newborns? How common are these?
• Are these defects related to nutrition or chemicals? Can we prevent them?
• Are these chemicals having an affect on a couples ability to conceive?
• What are some sources of toxins that we need to be avoiding?
• How long does it take for chemicals to be eliminated through the body?
• What was Tabitha’s Ah-Ha moment, that led her into this journey of spreading chemical awareness.
• What are the safety measures put in place in Australia with chemicals?
• There are many chemicals permitted in Australia that have been banned in Europe. How many chemicals that have been banned there are still used here, why is the such a difference?
• Not everyone reacts to chemicals the same way, some people may experience symptoms or hormonal imbalances, but some people are symptomless. What are some of the reasons this might be?
• What are Tabitha’s suggestions for taking the first step in toxin reduction.
• How fast food is having an impact on our environment and adding to future food security issues.
• Tabitha’s tips on reducing chemical exposure, in particular by improving air quality and reducing toxins around the home.

Listen to the podcast here:

Or click here to listen via soundcloud.

*I would like to address the often presented argument that “everything is a chemical”. I agree that this is very close to the truth (with the exception of sound and light which is actually matter). However, in this instance we are using the term chemicals for the sake of convenience, and actually referring to toxic and Endocrine Disrupting Chemicals, substances which are known or suspected to be capable of interfering with hormone receptors, hormone synthesis or hormone conversion which are in commercial use and have been proven or suspected of contributing to disease and dysfunction in humans, and chemicals which have shown to cause damage in ways such as mitochondrial dysfunction, neurodevelopmental toxicity, immune toxicity, oxidative stress and various levels of inflammation.

Subscribe to the podcast here:

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About Tabitha

Tabitha McIntosh is an experienced and respected Naturopath, clinical Nutritionist and educator. After attaining her Bachelor of Medical Science (University of NSW, 2001), she went on to pursue her passion for Integrative healthcare by completing an Advanced Diploma Naturopathy & Diploma Nutrition (Nature Care, 2005), and Post Grad Diploma in Nutritional & Environmental Medicine (Swinburne Uni, 2006).

Absolutely passionate about improving the health of everyone she comes in contact with, Tabitha’s impressive resume includes presenting at conferences and professional development seminars around Australia, lecturing in Nutrition at both Nature Care College and Endeavour College of Natural Health, International Community Health work, and contributing to Publications and Natural Medicine textbooks.

Tabitha is founder & director of Awaken Your Health in Woollahra, Sydney, where she has run her own private clinical practice for 13 years: integrating Naturopathic healing principles with the latest scientific research to educate and empower her clients, and implementing therapeutic diets to help clients reach their potential.

Tabitha is also a published author releasing her first book in 2016, co-authored with Dr Sarah Lantz, on nutritional and environmental health solutions, called One Bite at a Time: Reduce Toxic Exposure and Eat the World you Want. This book helps it’s readers to better navigate consumer and industrial chemicals found in our every day environment, to understand their significant impact on the human body and health; and outlines practical strategies and effective solutions for protecting our health so that we can live happier, heartier lives.

See www.onebite.com.au to learn more.

With both her book and her recently launched e-course I Quit Chemicals, Tabitha feels privileged to be able to inspire her clients and peers to maximise health outcomes by making conscious choices for the health of the planet, and the health of the future generations.

Check out her website www.awakenyourhealth.com.au for more information or to make a booking.

Related posts:

• What is preconception care?
• Why you should choose chemical free products for you and your baby
• Interview with Therese Kerr
• Choosing the right products for that time of the month
• A gut feeling – the gut brain axis

The post Reducing Chemicals to Protect Future Generations appeared first on Alison Mitchell Naturopath.